Introducing Our New Name

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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by MrBee » Post

Unpleasant wordplay

I don't really like the concept of new name.
“Luanti” is a wordplay on the Finnish word luonti (“creation”) and the programming language Minetest Luanti employs for games and mods, Lua. The goal was to avoid yet another plain English word (good luck finding something unique…) and highlight the core principles of the project. The fusion of celeron55’s Finnish nationality and the platform’s focus on content creation resulted in the birth of “Luanti”.
Lunatic? Anti-Lua? Luanti feels like a tongue twister. It is hard to pronounce and makes me uncomfortable to hear it. This word is also giving no clue about the game's content and would make minetest sound like a crappy game.

Anything but Luanti
I really like minetest's original name and its simplicity but I also understand that new name is needed but it DEFINITELY SHOULDN'T BE LUANTI should be something more pleasant for community.

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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by freshreplicant » Post

MrBee wrote:
Sat Oct 19, 2024 08:03
This word is also giving no clue about the game's content and would make minetest sound like a crappy game.
This is another reason why the rename was necessary. The part that's been renamed into Luanti is not a game at all. Minetest The Game (MTG), still exists, and it's still called Minetest. Luanti is not a game and has no 'game content' of its own.

It was always confusing that there were two separate things called Minetest: the original bare-bones game/modding base (what you're thinking of) and the engine/platform that supports a whole bunch of other original games other than MTG. That's the whole reason people kept having to say 'MTG' to distinguish the game from the engine.

Luanti is the new name for the engine and the part that acts sort of like game platform/launcher. Luanti is like Roblox is to all the games built in Roblox, or like the Build Engine is to games like Duke Nukem 3D or Ion Fury, or like the Unreal Engine is to games like Mass Effect and the hundreds of other games that use that engine or, in some ways, like Steam is to every other game on that platform.

If you still play the game called Minetest, don't worry, you can still tell people you play Minetest. Just like if I'm playing a game on Steam, I don't tell people I play Steam. I just tell them the name of the game I'm playing. If you play Exile or Nodecore, just tell people you play Exile or Nodecore.

The new name makes the separation between the platform and games clearer. Even better, we can also stop having to say 'Minetest The Game' or 'MTG', because now, Minetest is just the game. 😀

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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by TenPlus1 » Post

MT Game Engine would have been easier, with Minetest_Game being the example along with all the other user-made content available.

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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by Casimir » Post

In case there aren't enough opinions yet, let me add mine ;)
  • A name change was overdue and very much necessary.
  • Ideally it should be irrelevant what the engine is called. The real problem is that Luanti lacks a flag ship game.
  • Everyone will get used to "Luanti" just like everyone was enduring "Minetest".
The name itself is meh. Nothing special, but also not as bad as many alternatives that have been proposed along the years. Once you see the "anti" part in the name, you can't unsee it and that is annoying. I would rather have preferred a reference to the voxel nature, than to the scripting language. But, as I said, it shouldn't really matter. Any change away from "Minetest" is an improvement.

I'm out of the loop, so I don't know of the discussion preceding the change. Where can I read the discussion? What where the alternatives? How was it decided on?
Last edited by Casimir on Sat Oct 19, 2024 11:00, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by Desour » Post

Astrobe wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2024 13:39
(they have to tell their players to update Luanti itself, if nothing else, until Luanti gets the usual automatic update check).
There are auto update checks.
MrBee wrote:
Sat Oct 19, 2024 08:03
Lunatic? Anti-Lua? Luanti feels like a tongue twister. It is hard to pronounce and makes me uncomfortable to hear it. This word is also giving no clue about the game's content and would make minetest sound like a crappy game.
May I ask what your first language(s) is/are? (For me (german) it's not hard to pronounce at all. But maybe I'm pronouncing it wrong?)
(Also mtg *is* a crappy game, and luanti/minetest is a crappy engine in a few aspects.)
freshreplicant wrote:
Sat Oct 19, 2024 08:51
Minetest The Game (MTG), still exists, and it's still called Minetest.
MTG is an abbreviation for "Minetest Game". I don't remember having seen anyone call it "Minetest the Game".

And please note that "Minetest" still refers to the engine, if you want to speak about mtg, say mtg or minetest game or minetest_game.

-----------------

"Luanti" wasn't my favorite, but I can definitely live with it. And it's nice to see that there are so few complaints about it, which got me to accept it more.

I'm really happy that mods will now use the shorter `core.*`.

We still need an official short version (e.g. "lt", "lnt") and pronunciation (e.g. luanti (my vote goes for this. but which a, and which part of the word is stressed more?), lu-anti, lu an' tea, luan-tea).
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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by MrBee » Post

freshreplicant wrote:
Sat Oct 19, 2024 08:51
Luanti is the new name for the engine and the part that acts sort of like game platform/launcher. Luanti is like Roblox is to all the games built in Roblox, or like the Build Engine is to games like Duke Nukem 3D or Ion Fury, or like the Unreal Engine is to games like Mass Effect and the hundreds of other games that use that engine or, in some ways, like Steam is to every other game on that platform.
Oh you got me wrong. Surely I meant engine, I was just talking about its name from a player's viewpoint. For example, when someone is searching for a game in Google Play(Steam is more like a google play to think so) they don't usually think about such things as an engine or launcher, they simply say: "I want to play Roblox". Same with Luanti, but its name is quite unpleasant. I'd never search for "Luanti" or say "I wanna play Luanti". Thats what I wanted to say. (Actually, am I right thinking that launcher will be called Luanti?)
Desour wrote:
Sat Oct 19, 2024 10:54
May I ask what your first language(s) is/are? (For me (german) it's not hard to pronounce at all. But maybe I'm pronouncing it wrong?)
(Also mtg *is* a crappy game, and luanti/minetest is a crappy engine in a few aspects.)
That was an exaggeration, just wanted to make yall know how much I hate new name hehe

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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by isaiah658 » Post

MrBee wrote:
Sat Oct 19, 2024 11:34
Oh you got me wrong. Surely I meant engine, I was just talking about its name from a player's viewpoint. For example, when someone is searching for a game in Google Play(Steam is more like a google play to think so) they don't usually think about such things as an engine or launcher, they simply say: "I want to play Roblox". Same with Luanti, but its name is quite unpleasant. I'd never search for "Luanti" or say "I wanna play Luanti". Thats what I wanted to say. (Actually, am I right thinking that launcher will be called Luanti?)
I'm glad someone else understands why the name is so bad. You're not alone.

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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by Mantar » Post

TumeniNodes wrote:
Sat Oct 19, 2024 01:06
You can't always get what you want
But if you try sometimes, well, you might find
You get what you need
Ah, yeah"

Can't hear that song anymore without being reminded of this:
Spoiler
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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by radkitten » Post

I really don't care what the engine is called.. I'm just here to play voxel games.

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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by v-rob » Post

MrBee wrote:
Sat Oct 19, 2024 11:34
[...] they simply say: "I want to play Roblox". Same with Luanti, but its name is quite unpleasant. I'd never search for "Luanti" or say "I wanna play Luanti".
Really? To me, Roblox is a rather banal sounding name--I think Luanti is much nicer. The names Godot and Krita (to use the examples in the blog post) didn't "mean" anything to me when I first heard them, but they sound nice. When I learned their origins, I gained a greater appreciation for them. The same is true, I think, of Luanti. It doesn't "mean" anything to the uninitiated, but it's a nice enough sounding name. I certainly wouldn't have any problem saying "I wanna play Luanti" even if I didn't know the meaning.

In the end, it's completely subjective as to whether Luanti is a good sounding name or not. A lot of people like the name, and other don't. It's impossible to satisfy everyone, but we chose the best name we could.
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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by SakhotGamer » Post

bad
Last edited by SakhotGamer on Fri Dec 27, 2024 00:37, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by j8810kkw » Post

Man what a transition is coming about here. I am initially excited about what this could mean for the future of my little gaming endeavor. I literally don't have to tell the others that I use Minetest, but rather call it by another name from where they can see it for what a library of games it is. This is going to be amazing seeing all this unfold
I am still learning about this Minetest/Luanti thing. Looking forward to making some mods

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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by radkitten » Post

Some players I've talked to express that they wished the rename followed the design principle Keep It Simple Stupid (KISS).. I've seen OSVE mentioned several times in chat where OSVE stands for Open Source Voxel Engine. Those players don't see the point in over complicating the engine name with Luanti.. most don't get the word play. I'm fine with whatever the engine is renamed to, but there is a lot of negative chatter towards Luanti.

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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by TumeniNodes » Post

radkitten wrote:
Sun Oct 20, 2024 17:14
but there is a lot of negative chatter towards Luanti.
Give it a year.. it'll be fine
I also suspect more developers will be attracted to the more professional (or serious) seeming name.
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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by SevenRichieWhite » Post

I actually don't get why people hate it. Maybe it's change in general.
For me it's easy to pronounce, it's simple and refers to Lua. But I also don't really care what the engine is called. For me is just important that it's a working engine which I can use to play on the servers i like and code cool stuff.
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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by mary4 » Post

BASED!
poi! <3

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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by Mito551 » Post

hey, I wasn't expecting to see minetest in the news in the year 2024, but here we are, bringing me out of the woodwork!
congrats on the name change and I hope it lands well for you ^^

long live luanti!

ps. my two cents on the name: luanty/luantie would look more natural to a native english speaker imo

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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by Blockhead » Post

Brodie Robertson put out a video on it, This FOSS Game Takes On A Superior Name!. Mostly an outsider's perspective I think, though he's definitely opened the game before and knows about ContentDB.
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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by Mito551 » Post

Blockhead wrote:
Tue Oct 22, 2024 07:57
Brodie Robertson put out a video on it, This FOSS Game Takes On A Superior Name!. Mostly an outsider's perspective I think, though he's definitely opened the game before and knows about ContentDB.
that's how I found out!

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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by freshreplicant » Post

Blockhead wrote:
Tue Oct 22, 2024 07:57
Brodie Robertson put out a video on it, This FOSS Game Takes On A Superior Name!. Mostly an outsider's perspective I think, though he's definitely opened the game before and knows about ContentDB.
Pretty positive video, though he seems to have been under the impression that all games for Luanti are built on Minetest game.

He also strongly agreed with the reasoning behind not picking along lines of 'Libre*, Open*, Cube*, Mine*, Block*, Creation*' and well, he did call it a 'superior name'.


At the time of watching the comments are also largely positive about the rename or project in general (selecting some as I go through them from top to bottom):

"I'm glad we didn't get another foss project named LibreCube or something" (top comment with 241 upvotes).

"Luanti is a solid upgrade for the name." 81 upvotes.

"You know, I've never considered playing Minetest - or rather, Luanti as it is now. Maybe I'll give it a shot now." 81 upvotes too.

" I personally have avoided trying out minetest due to its branding because I thought it was just FOSS Minecraft which was very close-minded of me. " 39 upvotes.


Scrolling down the more middle of the road reception was this:
" Luanti... Lua... as generic as Minetest or Freeminer and others. But I do like the reference to the "luonti" word, creation. All-in-all, it's good. Better than Minetest anyway!" With 43 upvotes.

In that comment thread, somebody else wrote:

"I don't have a problem being generic. The old name was misleading, because people (me included) thought Minetest were just a Minecraft clone and nothing more. But turns out Luanti is similar in scope like Roblox, a game engine to build new games in.

Its no longer a game, its a game engine. And the new name reflects that, at least it distances it itself from being just a Minecraft clone. Its an appropriate upgrade in naming."


Then there's a few more positive ones:

"I love when names have double meanings. As someone who never heard of this game before, I like the new name. "

" So glad they renamed it actually, as minetest made it sound much lesser than MineCraft, and it is really an amazing engine. If you use the specific "MineClone2" mod/game it will make it feel almost identical to MineCraft, full with rails, mine carts, and even fully working red stone, it's really amazing. They even took many of the mobs over too."

"I love it and have been playing it for years. I like the change and thank you for presenting it to your audience."

"At first the name sounded odd, but after I heard how they thought of it I think I like it a lot. It's clever!
I've always been impressed by the game's performance. I only wish there were more graphics related mods making it look better. :)"

"Luanti? Love it. It's awesome that foss software starts to really take on some personality."


Though I've picked out the comments above, the comment thread has pretty positive vibes in general, some comments are not about Luanti, but full of enthusiasm about other free software games, and also some random Finnish people checking in. Also a few people who heard about the project for the first time and said they will check it out.


The worst one I came across 20 hours back was:

"I am just going to say it: It is a bad and super cheesy name. "Hey, wanna play Luanti?" "No, that sounds dumb, and how did you get into my house?". I read it as Lua + Anti. But hey, at least it is a better name than 99.9% of other FOSS project names, whose imagination only stretches to some random combo of "foss, libre" and the verb of what it does. "


Then there's this other middle of the road one:

"MineTest is good enough name for the engine, but MineTest-game is what I might have thought needed a new name. This is to say, I did not expect the opposite way around. "
Still interesting to see outsider's perspectives.

Also this negative one, which isn't about the name, but kinda funny:

"I have always had an unreasonable dislike for Minetest, because my mom once signed me up for a Minecraft summer camp where it wasn't actually Minecraft, it was Minetest. I was pretty displeased. "


It's interesting to see outsiders and newcomers perspectives on both the rename and the project in general, as I imagine that a good deal of the grumbling here is at least partially due to change or a departure from the familiar, though obviously some people might just outright hate it, which is also fine. Ultimately nobody will like every name.

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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by freshreplicant » Post

Desour wrote:
Sat Oct 19, 2024 10:54

MTG is an abbreviation for "Minetest Game". I don't remember having seen anyone call it "Minetest the Game".

And please note that "Minetest" still refers to the engine, if you want to speak about mtg, say mtg or minetest game or minetest_game.
Hah, that's embarrassing. I didn't realise MTG was one of those acronym where they take two letters from one word. In a few instances where I saw community members explain the difference between the engine and game to newcomers, I did see people use the phrases 'Minetest the engine' and 'Minetest the game' to distinguish them, so I thought it was because of 'The' (though would have been a fairly non-standard acronym.

I'm not really active on the engine side, so I didn't know about the engine, hm.
Desour wrote:
Sat Oct 19, 2024 10:54
"Luanti" wasn't my favorite, but I can definitely live with it. And it's nice to see that there are so few complaints about it, which got me to accept it more.

I'm really happy that mods will now use the shorter `core.*`.

We still need an official short version (e.g. "lt", "lnt") and pronunciation (e.g. luanti (my vote goes for this. but which a, and which part of the word is stressed more?), lu-anti, lu an' tea, luan-tea).
I think I say 'luan-tea'. After what you explained to me, LT would actually be a good abbreviation.

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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by Wuzzy » Post

Hello. I just finished the renaming in Libre Game Wiki.

I also updated the name in many pages of the Minetest Wiki and some pages in the Minetest Developer Wiki. The wikis should obviously be renamed as well. The main pages still need updating, because I don't have access. There are probably still a lot of pages where I overlooked something. I wish the wikis had a better search feature. I get shown a lot of translation pages (which I want to ignore), and pages containing "Minetest Game". Any chance I can filter those out?

The rename also means I will have to eventually update my games and mods. I guess I will start when the 5.10.0 release drops. I also have several tools with "Minetest" in the name. This includes the Minetest Translation Tools and MiBPoV. I'm planning a rename around the 5.10.0 release or maybe sooner.

BTW, I am not interested in the endless debate in whether the name change was good or bad. The fact is the name was changed so the important part is to actually get it done. Nothing is worsed than a half-arsed rebrand when the thing in question has an identity crisis for years.

So I like the fact that the official policy is to get the actual rename done as part of the next release.

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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by neo-zzz » Post

Wuzzy wrote:
Wed Oct 23, 2024 01:49
BTW, I am not interested in the endless debate in whether the name change was good or bad. The fact is the name was changed so the important part is to actually get it done. Nothing is worsed than a half-arsed rebrand when the thing in question has an identity crisis for years.

So I like the fact that the official policy is to get the actual rename done as part of the next release.
I am the same opinion... I think source code would not to be changed to the new name; for the old code.
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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by Astrobe » Post

Wuzzy wrote:
Wed Oct 23, 2024 01:49
Hello. I just finished the renaming in Libre Game Wiki.

I also updated the name in many pages of the Minetest Wiki and some pages in the Minetest Developer Wiki.
Thank you !
My game? It's Minefall.

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Re: Introducing Our New Name

by neo-zzz » Post

good work Wuzzy.. you are the best... ;-)
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